Why I am Gay-Friendly

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1. Chris Larimer says:

   July 2, 2008 at 3:35 pm

   Drew,

   I'm glad you got over your hate. I hope that you aren't implying that people opposed to homosexual behavior are either hateful by default (though some are) or have simply never met (or realized they met) a real live homosexual.

   My twin is transgendering (though for 6 years that was expressed as homosexual). I even struggled with feelings of homosexual attraction. However, that didn't change my convictions about what the Scriptures say about homosexual behavior.

   I've termed this sort of ethical sleight-of-hand relative moralism.
2. Chris Larimer says:

   July 2, 2008 at 2:35 pm

   Drew,

   I'm glad you got over your hate. I hope that you aren't implying that people opposed to homosexual behavior are either hateful by default (though some are) or have simply never met (or realized they met) a real live homosexual.

   My twin is transgendering (though for 6 years that was expressed as homosexual). I even struggled with feelings of homosexual attraction. However, that didn't change my convictions about what the Scriptures say about homosexual behavior.

   I've termed this sort of ethical sleight-of-hand relative moralism.
3. Drew says:

   July 2, 2008 at 4:37 pm

   Thanks Chris,

   I would hope never to generalize anyone with terms like that. That was just my own journey.

   Admittedly I have a very different way of understanding Scripture and its role relative to the furthering of the Kingdom of God than you do which I think we both know well enough. What we both can agree on is that Scripture is essential to further that Kingdom. The good news is that we both worship a God who is gracious enough to work with both of us in spite of the foolishness that we as fallen humans are so apt to practice.

   What I have also learned is that propositional and prepositional truth are analogous to our own cognitive development. That is to say, the conditions of our knowing are irreducibly structured by our relationality and our relationality then structures what we know. I am an interactionist here. We always come to a situation with assumptions (prespositional) and those assumptions will either change over time or they will remain rigid (propositional if you will). Conviction should straddle between these two poles and tie them off in order that our experience achieves equilibrium. Prayer and communion with God is what supplies the energy to make this possible for it is clear that we cannot do it on our own.

   James Loder was a significant influence to me at PTS and my own thinking is greatly influenced by him. That and Simone Weil as taught by Diogenes Allen (just so you know what influenced me during this time and from that point on).
4. dtatusko says:

   July 2, 2008 at 3:37 pm

   Thanks Chris,

   I would hope never to generalize anyone with terms like that. That was just my own journey.

   Admittedly I have a very different way of understanding Scripture and its role relative to the furthering of the Kingdom of God than you do which I think we both know well enough. What we both can agree on is that Scripture is essential to further that Kingdom. The good news is that we both worship a God who is gracious enough to work with both of us in spite of the foolishness that we as fallen humans are so apt to practice.

   What I have also learned is that propositional and prepositional truth are analogous to our own cognitive development. That is to say, the conditions of our knowing are irreducibly structured by our relationality and our relationality then structures what we know. I am an interactionist here. We always come to a situation with assumptions (prespositional) and those assumptions will either change over time or they will remain rigid (propositional if you will). Conviction should straddle between these two poles and tie them off in order that our experience achieves equilibrium. Prayer and communion with God is what supplies the energy to make this possible for it is clear that we cannot do it on our own.

   James Loder was a significant influence to me at PTS and my own thinking is greatly influenced by him. That and Simone Weil as taught by Diogenes Allen (just so you know what influenced me during this time and from that point on).
5. Alan says:

   July 4, 2008 at 6:01 pm

   That is some story, Drew. Honestly, from reading your blog, I would never have thought that you would have ever have had the slightest trace of animosity towards gays. Quite a testimonial!

   The observation that presuppositions, or as I would put it, pre-judice, is often overcome when one is put into the actual circumstances of having to make a decision is very true. My understanding is that this often happens to those who are against abortion and are confronted with an unwanted pregnancy.

   Given your experience, what do you now think of the notion of "Love the sinner, hate the sin"? I have read an essay by Eric Reitan (unavailable on-line) in which he claims (if I remember correctly) that this is not actually possible or entirely honest, at least in the case of homosexuality.
6. Alan says:

   July 4, 2008 at 5:01 pm

   That is some story, Drew. Honestly, from reading your blog, I would never have thought that you would have ever have had the slightest trace of animosity towards gays. Quite a testimonial!

   The observation that presuppositions, or as I would put it, pre-judice, is often overcome when one is put into the actual circumstances of having to make a decision is very true. My understanding is that this often happens to those who are against abortion and are confronted with an unwanted pregnancy.

   Given your experience, what do you now think of the notion of "Love the sinner, hate the sin"? I have read an essay by Eric Reitan (unavailable on-line) in which he claims (if I remember correctly) that this is not actually possible or entirely honest, at least in the case of homosexuality.